Charley Warner: “Ukrainian denominations will not mature in their theological thinking until they write books on theology on their own”

Charley Warner was one of the first teachers at the Odesa theological seminary. He lived in Ukraine till 1999 and then moved to Austria. During the EAAA conference “10 Years of Theological Education” RISU was able to ask him a few questions about changes in Protestant theological education, developments in modern Protestant theology, and his mission.

Charley Warner belongs to the rare Westerners who have a rather deep knowledge of the Soviet Union, its collapse, and the emergence of an independent Ukraine. He first came to the Soviet Union in 1977. And in 1987 with his wife he came as a missionary to the Soviet Union. His academic background is in Russian studies and in missiology (Birmingham and Oxford universities). He moved to the Soviet Union in July 1991 and was there during the “putsch” (August Coup 1991) in Odesa. Charley Warner was one of the first teachers at the Odesa theological seminary. He lived in Ukraine till 1999 and then moved to Austria. During the EAAA conference “10 Years of Theological Education” RISU was able to ask him a few questions about changes in Protestant theological education, developments in modern Protestant theology, and his mission.

What was your work like in Ukraine during the Soviet period and in the early 90s?

In the Soviet period we were limited to small study groups, there were no theological schools to teach at. When it became possible to start schools we knew that it was what we wanted to do and to be involved in and through some friends we got to know that a school in Odesa was starting. Sergey Sannikov invited me to help him to start a Baptist seminary in Odesa.

Most people would say that around 1989-1991 was the best period for Christians in Ukraine. It started with the celebration of the millennium of the Christianity in Rus in 1988. And after 1989 there was more freedom for Christians to do things and in Soviet prices. They had the freedom to do something and to do it cheaply. They started building churches, schools, and depending on the denomination other things like monasteries.

And what is the situation now?

Now we have plenty of theological schools. Personally I am involved in Protestant education, but there are Catholic and Orthodox schools, too. And there is an opportunity to do things that you couldn’t do in Soviet times and that is exciting, but the cost of maintaining theological institutions is going up and up and it’s getting harder to have full-time students because they want to keep their jobs or stay involved in the church and only occasionally attend theological courses. It is especially true if they don’t live in a big city. More and more students want to attend lectures in the evening or on weekends.

The first graduates of our Protestant schools in Ukraine got a great education, came to the church and realized that they needed to get a job to support their families. And the next generation of students (after 1999) who looked at this first generation, decided that they were going to get a job first and then get a theological education.

Do you encourage your students to get both secular and theological educations? 

I think that it’s a really good thing to have both and I personally have chosen this path. To gain respect in society, a person needs to have not only a theological degree but also a state university degree. There are some people who have not formed their own personal theology and if that’s the case then they go to a state university to study religious studies.

If you know what and why you believe before you go to secular school, you doesn’t change that much. It depends where you are and who you are before you go to a school. If someone went to the theological school they would have the foundation, the basis. I encourage people to get a management degree, a marketing degree especially if they want a position like an academic dean or other managerial position.

What challenges do you see facing Ukrainian Protestant theology? 

Here people think that there is one Ukrainian theology, there isn’t.  As well as one American or German. There is a variety. So in terms of challenges, we at the Protestant level have done lots of translations. But how many good Protestant books were actually written by Ukrainian Protestants? I don’t think that any Ukrainian denomination – Orthodox, Catholic or Protestant – will mature in their theological thinking until they write important books on theology on their own.

Do you plan to come back to Ukraine?

No. I have many other ministries, for example, developing national mission movements. For example, Ukrainians can bring teaching to other cultures. And this really happens. I’m in charge in groups in Eastern Europe – Poland, Romania, Ukraine, and Russia. Next year (September 2012) we (Evangelical mission agencies) will gather in Lviv for a consultation on how to strengthen the movement that started and how to do missionary work across the cultures better.

Do you think of Ukraine as missionary country?

In Protestant Russia and Ukraine it was not until 1996 that Ukrainians started going to other nations for missions. It is a very, very beginning because the mentality of the churches here was “We need to work here and why do we need to send Ukrainians to Kenya?” It has been hard for them to go to other cultures. And in the last 10 years that’s started to change.